*This message was transferred with a trial version of CommuniGate(tm) Pro*
>jonathon <jemery@execpc.com> wrote:
> > .....According to Lee Holland (President of MVPA) whom I spoke to about this last
> > summer, one of these requiements that the hmmwv does not meet is that there
> > is no place on the rear bumper to mount a license plate.......
Mark wrote,
>...... But if they're going to use the lack
>of a license plate bracket to deny me the use of my vehicle...
I have read the postings on this issue with much interest since I was one of the first civilians in the country to title, register, license, insure and drive a military Hummer. Or should I say my 1984 AM General, Utility body vehicle, # PRD351 (as my registration and AAA insurance slips said).
Most of us on the list have little experience with something we Machine Gun people call "The Stupid Test". As I am a holder of a Federal Firearms License with a NFA endorsement I must deal with officials and bureaucrats on local, county, state and federal levels as do many of my customers. I have seen many different versions of this test at all levels.
What is a stupid test you say? Simple. It is a statement made to see if you are; A, so stupid as to believe the statement thereby allowing the person making the statement to intimidate you and prevent you from continuing on in whatever it is you want to do. OR; B, that you are NOT stupid enough to believe the statement forcing the person making it to deal with you on a factual basis from that point on.
Quick example of a stupid test. A customer of mine (who holds a federal collectors license) took his machine gun transfer form (form 4) to his local police chief to have him sign it. The chief refused telling him "It is illegal for citizens to own machine guns". The customer then came back to me crestfallen that he could not get the gun he had wanted. I explained the "Stupid Test" to him, "armed" him with copies of the Local, State and Federal laws and the Attorney General of the State of Michigan's determination that it was legal for collectors to own such weapons and sent him back. When the chief gave him the stupid test again, he presented him with all the facts. The chief, seeing my customer had failed the test (he was NOT stupid) immediately signed the form. (No disrespect to police here, this IS a true story)
What's this got to do with this Hummer discussion? Simple. A statement like "you can't own/license a Hummer because it doesn't have a place on the rear bumper for a license plate bracket" is a Stupid Test plain and simple!
If you're stupid.....you'll say "darn, and I really wanted one of those Hummers. If it only had a bracket.
If your not stupid.....(like John, Mark and most of us) you'll say "no problem, I'll just make one. Please show me the Local, State and Federal regulations on the license plate brackets" Now you've put the onus on them to (A) Show you why a bracket cannot be fitted and (B) dig out the regulations on the same. They will now realize that the next thing they tell you had better not be more B.S. because you're not stupid and you want proof (in writing).
It has been stated that the Hummers from that auction were sold as "off road" vehicles. If the buyers signed an agreement to that effect then they may be bound by that agreement (I'm not a attorney). If you purchased a vehicle from one of them and did not sign an agreement then you may not have to abide by it. The agreement may itself have been a "Stupid Test" and something that seems binding but is legally not.
The letter from AM General certainly looks like a "Stupid Test". The idea being that you read the letter and take it at face value, and never license your vehicle. OR you contact an attorney, check local, State and Federal laws and see if they in fact can prohibit you from making it street legal and operate upon the roads and highways.
Humm........upon the highways.........Maybe we need to give AM General a "Stupid Test" of our own.
Something along the lines of this;
To: AM General, Office of Legal Counsel
Dear Sirs,
I am in receipt of a copy of your letter stating that Hummers (HUMVEE) manufactured for the Armed Forces and subsequently sold on the civilian market are for off road use only due to said vehicles being unfit and lacking safety features required for use upon the public highways. This revelation is most distressing. Said vehicles are operated daily upon the public highways by members of the Armed Forces of the United States both here and abroad. These military personnel are our sons and daughters and their safety and well being concern all of us. It would seem unconscionable that AM General Corporation would manufacture, much less allow a vehicle so unsafe as to be limited to off road use to be operated upon the public highways by the military.
I would point out that said vehicles are operated on the very same public highways and in the presence and conjunction with vehicles operated by the public at large. If the allegations in your letter are correct this may constitute a clear and present danger to the public at large and to the members of the Armed Forces who operate these vehicles.
I believe it would be unconscionable of me not make this grave danger known. I believe that, If your letter is correct, action should be taken to prevent the Armed Forces of the United States from operating said AM General produced vehicles on any public roads and highways world wide.
I also believe it would be unconscionable of me to alert my elected representatives, both State and Federal, and the media, without first allowing your office to clarify your position on the safety and roadability of your vehicle design.
Sincerely,
(add your name)
Now, does anyone think AM General wants publicity stating the Hummer is unsafe? Who would want to buy a civilian one if the basic design is unsafe?
Perhaps the next "Stupid Test" from AMG might be a little different........
Jim Gilmore MVPA # 5843
Member Ist Michigan AOD Chapter MVPA
Great Lakes Chapter MVPA
Ohio Motor Pool Chapter MVPA
Red Ball Chapter MVPA
Ontario Military Vehicle Association
Midwest Military Vehicle Assocation
-------------------------------------------------------------------
2656 Wiethoff, Inkster, Mi. 48141
313-561-8826 voice 313-730-1652 fax
-------------------------------------------------------------------
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b29 : Tue Apr 04 2000 - 21:57:18 PDT