Amen, brother, amen.
Rick
----- Original Message -----
From: <JaxInCalifornia@aol.com>
To: "Military Vehicles Mailing List" <mil-veh@mil-veh.org>
Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2001 10:13 PM
Subject: Re: [MV] Sting operations/response
> "....guys, here's the deal: I've been the subject of at least two sting
> attempts. Once at a gun show, a fellow comes up to me and asks if I want
to
> buy a de-milled .50 Cal Browning." "...And when the feds knock down your
> door, shoot them in the face, the cowards all wear bullet proof vests.
Take
> a few of the bastards with you." John
>
> John, while there is no evidence to say you were not about to be setup,
there
> is no evidence to say you were either.
>
> No offense John, but I been down this road before with folks who know for
> fact those feds were "about" to do this or that, when the "fact" was
never
> established.
>
> But, let's go with it for a moment and see what you have.
>
> Professionally speaking (over 25 years of criminal law, law enforcement
and
> courtroom experience), I would say when it comes to a sting operation most
of
> the time it goes down like this:
>
> Somebody tries to get you to sell them something, not them sell you
> something. However, the latter does happen, but on rare occasion. The
reason
> the latter doesn't happen too much is the problem of entrapment. Thats a
big
> problem too!
>
> In the situation you have described the entrapment is quite clear (also
quite
> illegal, if that is what they were up too). Let's say you buy an active
.50
> cal. MG on the good faith that it is in fact a demil job as represented by
> the seller and then they bust you. Now they got the problem, because they
> entrapped you and they can't do that and still get a conviction, least not
> legally and by any court I know. Conviction is the key word here. You
can
> bust anybody, convicting them is another story.
>
> In our court and under this circumstance, the burden of proof falls on the
> cops and they must prove beyond a shadow of a doubt and to a moral
certainty
> that you absolutely knew in your mind at the very moment of the sale that
it
> was an illegal weapon and you bought it anyway.
>
> That ain't easy to prove my friend.
>
> Now unless all those agents that were involved in this bogus sting,
including
> their immediate supervisor, the federal prosecutor all want to waste their
> time and be humiliated in front of a federal judge, the jury, a courtroom
> full of witnesses and the news media, there is no way in God's green earth
> they are going to take a case like that into court and there is no way any
> professional agent would set a sting up like that. I can see how some
> backwater sheriff's deputy who lacks sufficient legal training might, but
> even that is a stretch. If they did, you can sue the socks off them for
> stupid move like that and there is plenty of lawyers chomping at the bit
to
> sue the deep pockets of any government agency, believe it!
>
> Kinda makes me think that whatever was going on, it was likely NOT a
federal
> sting.
>
> Now as to shooting the fed bastards in the face if they break into your
> house. A citizen is only allowed to use such force as may be prudent to
save
> him/her from death or serious bodily injury. The burden of proof falls on
> you to show such a situation existed and that you didn't know it was
federal
> officers trying to serve a search or arrest warrant when they came through
> the door.
>
> All warrants require knock and notice, unless specially approved by a
judge
> to serve it without knock and notice. In that case some very serious
> conditions that must be met. Those kind of warrants almost never get
> approved because they require such a high burden of proof to show the
need.
> The judge knows the risks if he gives them this special warrant. A lot of
> times it should have been a no knock warrant, but the judge wouldn't stick
> his neck out and instead put the officers at greater risk with a knock
type
> warrant. So the police get to say after pounding the door of the armed
and
> dangerous suspect's place, "This is the police, we have a warrant for your
> arrest, unlock the door now or we're coming in!" Gee, wouldn't you like
to
> be the first guy thru that door now?
>
> You won't find a lot of sympathetic juries out here if you shoot a cop
after
> a knock and notice warrant, especially when he/she is in full uniform.
>
> I know you are angry and frustrated, a lot of nice people get that way
over
> stupidity in government and law enforcement, but don't ever let your anger
> overrun your IQ. Better to step back, calm down and then act in a legal
way
> to resolve it.
>
> And lastly about those "bastards"... again I know it was said in anger,
but
> now I got get up on my soap box and shout this out loud and clear. This
is
> for everybody who has ever hated cops or agents as a group:
>
> Those people just didn't come from outer space! They were all once kids,
> raised in our own neighborhoods, they went to our schools, our churches
and
> some are our own sons and daughters.
>
> Most folks could not begin to appreciate what those "kids" went through to
> become officers and federal agents. Psychological testing, physical
testing,
> IQ tests, background checks and in the end I bet darn few of us could have
> made the grade, but they did because they are the best of who we are.
Sworn
> and entrusted with a solemn and sacred duty to protect and defend... us!
> Often this is done at the cost of their own lives.
>
> Speaking of that cost, on my right side I'm looking at a "Memoriam" in a
cop
> magazine. There are 32 state, local and federal officers listed there,
men
> and women all killed in the line of duty. Ever heard of Cpl. Larry
Mitchell,
> age 23? He was shot while responding to disturbance call. He left behind
a
> wife and little son. Or how about Sgt. Wilber Berry, aged 53. You know
he
> was almost to retirement, when he was cut down by gunfire as he approached
a
> stolen vehicle parked in the suspect's front yard. Wilber left behind a
> wife, two sons, a daughter and five grandchildren who will dearly miss
> grandpa.
>
> There are a lot of names you never heard of here because it's not news
worthy.
> But, you will read over and over about Ruby Ridge. (Funny, not one of
these
> survivors ever got 10 million dollars for a wrongful death suit either. )
>
> The bottom line here is, despite all their good training and good
intentions
> cops are still human. Mistakes happen, warrants do get served on the
wrong
> house, stings do go wrong, bad arrests are made and yes, some bad cops do
> dishonor their profession. It happens and that is something we do read
about
> and the anger towards builds.
>
> Well, enough, I just hope I gave you all something to think about next you
> feel like taking matters a step beyond legal or accusing cops of something
> they might not have done.. ( like that never happens! lol ).
>
> Hey.. you be careful out there!
>
> Jack Lee
>
>
>
>
>
>
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This archive was generated by hypermail 2b29 : Tue Aug 07 2001 - 09:34:14 PDT