I appreciate you adding to this discussion.
WF2U wrote:
> For your information, Israel has a thriving Christian and Moslem population
> which is enjoying full citizenship, just like rest of the population. There
> are Arab members of Parliament, (both Christians and Moslems) as well as
> Government ministers and officials. There are Moslems and also Christians
> serving in the Israeli Armed Forces who traditionally take pride in their
> service and citizenship. Some of them achieved staff officers positions.
Israel is a Jewish state, is it not? How does Israel maintain a non
bias
towards non Jews when the state religion is Judaism? How do the
existing
Christians and Muslims feel about Israel granting citizenship to Russian
Jews
when they are unable to have their own families brought into Israel? I
suggest
that full citizenship does not mean equal rights. The fact that some of
"them"
has made it into government is good, the fact that you have to point
that out is
sad.
>
> The present day Palestinians - by the way, my parents can be called
> Palestinians, prior to the Israeli independence they carried Palestinian
> ID's as British Colonial subjects - rejected peace with Israel. Their own
> brethren from the Arab countries rejected the ones who chose or were ordered
> by their leaders to become refugees, kept them without ANY citizenship and
> used them as pawns in their "struggle" against Israel. They could have had a
> state of their own by now if they were working towards peace.
Yes, the Palestinians have been persecuted by governments other than
Israel.
Does that make it ok for Israel to continue to do the same to the
Palestinians
in the Occupied territories? Two wrongs does not make a right. (There
is a
terrible irony here that a Jewish state feels the need to occupy and
persecute
another group of people - after all the Jews of Europe endured, you
would have
thought they would have learned - persecution is evil - regardless of
the cause)
> Another little piece of information: about 400,000 "Palestinians" left and
> were kept as refugees but Israel took in about 600,000 Jewish refugees from
> the Arab countries - They were given Israeli citizenship and were integrated
> into the society. The Jordanian and Egyptian governments kept (until the '67
> war when Israel gained the West Bank and Gaza) the Palestinians under
> military government and imposed curfews and travel restrictions on them.
> Where were you then to complain about the Palestinians' plight?
I was 9 years old and worried about the riots in Detroit at about that
time.
(;->)
> about 400,000 "Palestinians" left<
That is sort of like saying the Redcoats "left" the US after the
revolutionary
war. The vast majority of the Palestinians did not leave of their own
free will
in 1948. Israeli terrorist squads were dispatched to rid the villages
of
Palestinians so the land could be claimed by the people who where
"chosen".
Many atrocities were committed. Many of the military people in charge
of the
atrocities rose to become leaders in Israel. And yes a lot of Jews in
neighboring countries were rightfully afraid of what was going to happen
to them
and fled into Israel. I fail to see how this should endear Israel to
our
sympathies so they can continue to persecute the Palestinians. Syria,
Egypt and
Jordan and the other Arab countries have certainly contributed to this
conflict. No one is lily white.
>
> But I'm sure I'm wasting my time trying to bring up some facts.
No you were quite factual, it's the spin I don't like.
>
> I apologize to the list that this nonsense is going on but I had to reply to
> this publicly.
I appreciate your contribution.
> Finally, the terrorists are not out to harm the US because of its support of
> Israel. They are out to demolish the Western way of life, the creative,
> compassionate and enterprising spirit, the wealth the US has. It's not a
> religious war, just because they call themselves Moslems (or the Red
> Brigades, or the Bader-Meinhoff Group or whatever). It's a war of the
> depraved, jealous mind against our way of life. If Israel didn't exist,
> they'd find another enemy they'd hate just as much, as they go after the
> "Big Satan", the US.
The fact that we have had undying support for whatever Israel has done
has
helped paint a big target on the US. When was the last time foreign
terrorists
attacked Sweden? But like you say, these folks are nuts, lunatics,
fanatics and
cannot be characterized as anything but fringe extremist groups. They
must be
hunted down and brought to justice.
> Ready for flames....
Thanks for contributing to the discussion! (Not exactly a flame..)
>
> Meir Ben-Dror
>
> MVPA # 23503
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Military Vehicles Mailing List [mailto:mil-veh@mil-veh.org] On
> Behalf Of Ryan Gill
> Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 12:13 AM
> To: Military Vehicles Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [MV] Late comments on WTC attacks
>
> At 11:51 PM -0400 9/13/01, Meir Ben-Dror wrote:
> >Although fortunately there is freedom of expression in this country, and
> >any ignorant bigot is entitled to spew his drivel, I have to react to this.
> >Again, this comes to show that some bottom feeders are comfortable to
> repeat
> >vicious and biased propaganda, instead of learning the facts - but they'd
> >rather not confuse themselves with the real facts.
> >
> >This is as far as I'll go with this on the list. The rest will follow by
> >direct e-mail to Mr. Goebbels himself.
>
> I'm not sure where the Third Reich comes in here. Perhaps it stems
> from the Nazi practice of bulldozing villages that are centers of
> resistance?
>
> If Zionism means the Jews have a safe secure place they will share
> with Christians and Muslims then great, I'm all for it. If it means
> that they get to kick everyone else out regardless of past residence
> then I have a problem. The current situation is too much of a
> Palestinians as the unter-menschen (sp?).
>
> After all, you don't see Pagans clamoring for a homeland where London
> is do you?
>
> --
> - Ryan Montieth Gill DoD# 0780 (Smug #1) / AMA / SOHC -
> - ryan.gill@SPAMturner.com I speak not for CNN, nor they for me -
> - rmgill@SPAMmindspring.com www.mindspring.com/~rmgill/ -
> - '85 Honda CB700S - '72 Honda CB750K - '76 Chevy MonteCarlo -
>
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This archive was generated by hypermail 2b29 : Mon Oct 08 2001 - 10:58:59 PDT