From: Dave Cole (DavidCole@tk7.net)
Date: Wed Apr 03 2002 - 22:35:40 PST
Kevin Doriety pointed this out and I just wanted to underline it and copy the text from the Hemmings web site.
http://clubs.hemmings.com/arizonaaths/trucks/gotcha.html
I've known this for several years now, but finding it written down anyware has been tough.
I discovered this in Indiana first when I found out that some people were converting semi tractor-trailers to campers. (No kidding) They were cutting windows
into van trailers and converting them into jumbo travel trailer rigs. I also saw this at tractor shows in Indiana where farmers were driving in old restored semi
tractor trailers with show tractors on them. I asked why they had "not for hire" on the side of the tractor and they always said to avoid being labeled a
commercial hauler and the CDL requirements. But again, as I have said before, the state governments are incredibly inconsistent. Tell this to a typical BMV
person and they will flat out tell you that you are nuts. The amount of misinformation out there on CDL applicability is huge. The 26K lb rule just doesn't
apply unless you are hauling commercially. But as it pointed out in this website, the states are not consistent on the subject.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The USDOT recently drafted a second "exclusionary letter" pertaining to antique truck driving. It reinforces our original Arizona letter pointing out that Non-
commercial Historic Vehicles do not fall under the jurisdiction of Federal Motor Carrier regulations.
Joe Phelan, an antique truck crusader in the State of Vermont obtained this new letter from the USDOT Vermont Division in Montpelier, and forwarded it to
us. It helps correct the growing misconception that "larger antique trucks" must still be regulated by the commercial regulations. This recent letter declares:
" (The Vermont USDOT interpretations) support and echo the letter?from our Arizona Division. The FMSCR simply do not apply to personal or non-commercial
use of a vehicle, regardless of its size. This means the vehicle is not subject to having a USDOT number, and the driver is not required to have a medical
certificate or a logbook, among other things." (signed, Judith R. Hinds, Division Program Specialist, Federal Office of Motor Carrier and Highway Safety,
Montpelier, Vermont).
Officer Hinds also included in support of that letter the following federal interpretation published in the FMSCR Hand Book which explains:
"Question 21: Does the exemption in 390.3(f)(3) for the 'occasional transportation of personal property by individuals not for compensation nor in the
furtherance of a commercial enterprise' apply to persons who occasionally use CMVs {Commercial Motor Vehicles} to transport cars, boats, horses, etc. to
races, tournaments, shows or similar events, even if prize money is offered at these events?
"Guidance: The exemption would apply to this kind of transportation, provided: (1) The underlying activities are not undertaken for profit, i.e., (a) prize money
is declared as ordinary income for tax purposes, and (b) the cost of the underlying activities is not deducted as a business expense for tax purposes; and,
where relevant; (2) corporate sponsorship is not involved. Drivers must confer with their State of licensure to determine the licensing provisions to which they
are subject."
There are now two "USDOT Exclusionary Letters" confirming that our Non-commercial Historic Vehicles are excluded from federal motor carrier regulations.
(Write the Newsletter Editor if you need copies of these documents to carry aboard your antique hobby truck weighing over 26,000#, with more than 2-axles,
and burning diesel "Use Fuel". Ask for the "Arizona exclusionary document package".)
The states of California*, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Arizona, and lately Vermont* now acknowledge that the driving of antique hobby trucks are not governed by
the commercial motor vehicle regulations. (*California & *Vermont State motor vehicle driver licensing laws do require residents of those states to obtain CDL's
to drive vehicles of a large GVW type: yet they exempt heavyweight "recreation vehicles" from CDL requirements. (There remains a discriminatory problem
here!) ATHS & ATCA members need to work on this impropriety of selective legal enforcement. More work for somebody to do.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
4/3/2002 12:42:36 PM, "kevin doriety" <a61ford@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>>From: willewantme@aol.com
>>Reply-To: GreenSix@yahoogroups.com
>>To: GreenSix@yahoogroups.com
>>Subject: Re: [GreenSix] Best way to move a 5 ton long distance
>>Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2002 08:57:08 EST
>>
>> You had better check on the CDL over 26,000lbs you need a CDL a
>>poosible
>>exemption is farm or government equity. One of the reasons that 2.5 toners
>>are not required to have a CDL is they have a GVR of 24,000 lbs, a 5 Ton
>>CDL
>>required!
>> I own a 5 Ton a M-817, might point out even school buses require a CDL
>>if
>>over 26,000 lbs! A CDL may be a class "A" if it is a combiation meaning a
>>pivital point, the goose neck or 5th wheel is this point and if over
>>26,000lbs require a Class A CDL, Non trailer heavy trucks Dumps, Stakes,
>>Vans
>>over 26,000 require a B CDL.
>> As I said a farm application may excude that, but a lot of things are
>>legal till you get caught! Check with your DMV on CDL requirements, private
>>use does not excude CDL requirements, 20 Tons at 55MPH is work not a job
>>for
>>weekenders.
>> Might like to also look back or go to the MV list and see that 5 Ton
>>do
>>need a CDL!
>>Billy P. Whyde
>>M-817, M-103 owner in Ohio, CDL "A" with all endorsements
>
>There is currently a DOT letter of exemption out on non commercial use of
>large vehicles. The Arizona chapter of the American Truck Historical Society
>has an article on their web site in a column called "officer gotcha". The
>address is : http://clubs.hemmings.com/arizonaaths/trucks/gotcha.html. If
>this doesnt work, use a search engine to find the ATHS web site, then go to
>the AZ chapter. A state could always add more regs, But the DOT specifically
>mentions personal use and not for hire. That is why these large RV's don't
>need a Dot number or the driver a cdl, logbook,etc.
>
>
>
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