From: G.R. Baker (tired_iron@mounet.com)
Date: Fri Mar 14 2003 - 17:43:20 PST
Let's all cool it with this stuff before it gets out of hand, my president
is getting disted and that isn't good. Everyone has different opinions and
that's ok, everyone has the right to be wrong at least once and none of us
are close to perfect. Let's get back to MVs, us arguing about this is like
two fleas arguing about where the dog their riding on is going.
I still need an antenna for my Stuart, and Fair Radio only has part of a
set.
GRB
-----Original Message-----
From: Military Vehicles Mailing List [mailto:mil-veh@mil-veh.org]On
Behalf Of David Cole
Sent: Friday, March 14, 2003 8:10 PM
To: Military Vehicles Mailing List
Subject: Re: [MV] The French
Excuse me! The last time I checked you were not the list moderator.
I knew that your ranting was going down hill and you proved your knowledge
by the last line in your message. You can sign off from the list anytime
you like or hit the delete key like everyone else who doesn't want to read
a thread. (That's the key that says D-E-L-E-T-E on the keyboard) If that
doesn't work, do all of us a favor and pull the plug on your computer.
> We elect our leaders with the expectation they will look out for us.
First of all, G. Bush wasn't elected by the majority of Americans. He lost
the popular vote. He was voted in by the supreme court, remember?
G. Bush want's us to shut up and keep on going while the country goes down
the dumper with his obsession with Iraq. Iraq can't even launch a Piper
Cub without us tracking it via Radar. They can't point a radar antenna at
a dog without us knowing about it. Comparisons to Hitler? Come on, the
guy is totally contained. Is Saddam a bad guy, sure. Him and about 50
other country leaders should go.
> As such we must place out trust in them to do the right thing.
Yeah right, George Bush has no interest in the Oil Companies, Nixon was an
excellent president, and Bill Clinton was a real moral guy. Tell me more,
you are just overflowing with wisdom, or is that...
> Otherwise sit back and SHUT THE F@%K UP
OK, now you have truly proved your intelligence. Yes, you have certainly
impressed me. That's about as un-American as it gets. I'm sure Sadam
requests the same of the people under his thumb. Gosh, I guess you
probably think that you have leadership potential now. Do us all a favor
and pull the plug!!!
Flameproof Dave
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003 09:40:46 -0500, Mugno, Anthony <AMugno@SITAAPS.org>
wrote:
> Oh yeah one more thing!!
>
> As for those Human shields who have gone over their. I applaud them.
> They
> stand out from the average Iraqi who is NOT there by choice. They make
> damn
> good targets that can be easily be distinguished from the locals.
> I'll even help "paint" those targets maybe Saddam will use them to try to
> protect sensitive military sites hehehe
>
> We elect our leaders with the expectation they will look out for us. As
> such we must place out trust in them to do the right thing. If you are
> unhappy about the results of an election then get out their and motivate
> more of your friends to vote next. Otherwise sit back and SHUT THE F@%K
> UP
>
> That is All
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Glen Bedel [mailto:GBedel@designforum.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:58 AM
> To: mil-veh@mil-veh.org
> Subject: Re: [MV] The French
>
>
> Typically a criminal in this country if told by the Police to drop your
> weapons), you do as they say or suffer the consequences. There is always
> no
> time to argue about time to disarm.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Seidts [mailto:jseidts@astory.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 12,
> 2003 8:51 AM
> To: mil-veh@mil-veh.org
> Subject: Re: [MV] The French
>
>
> Steve,
> You are right about history, but remember whose father put Saddam in
> power, who funded the Mujaheddin and then dropped them like a hot potato,
> and who stood around while lots of muslims were ethnically cleansed in
> the
> Balkans. We also tolerated the Turkish solution to the "Kurd" problem,
> which was to declare them terrorists (which they rightly were) and kill
> lots
> of them, driving them into Iraq; now of course, they are our deepest
> concern.
> I think that my objection to this war is the one most of Europe has-
> give the disarmament a chance. If we let ourselves get into a conflict
> where WMD is used, we are setting a precedent that has few borders.
> There
> is a strong Pan-Islamic movement in the middle east, whether we want to
> admit to it or not, and I think us respectfully allowing a nation to
> choose
> its path is better in the long term than going to war. Not doing so is
> to
> risk a spiraling security problem here in the US. Maybe not more WTC's,
> but
> certainly more sniper incidents, Atlanta Olympic bombings, etc. Saddam's
> smoke in mirrors anyway-his day is coming due to his age. My solution-
> just take the oil fields, and pump them while holding the money in
> escrow,
> less the cost of the occupation. Saddam will be gone in a year.
> The rest of the security council is just trying to make sure we are
> not bailing out our economy by going after the cheap oil in Iraq.
> Especially
> when our leaders are talking about possibly decades of occupation of the
> country?
> Any how, this is only a prelude to what is going to happen with
> China. The worlds fastest growing economy is going to come into conflict
> with the worlds second longest standing rich economy, I'm sure. And I'd
> rather have the hands clean on the part of the US before we get into that
> one. That is the real future conflict I am talking about. Anything we
> do
> today that reverberates for 40 years (as a unilateral attack will do) is
> something we need to consider very carefully. Colin Powell, the one I
> respect most out of our leadership right now, felt the same way. He was
> told to toe the line...
> Then again, if our economy is in the tank as bad as they suspect it
> will go in the White House-then we need the cheap oil!!!
>
> I think you know what I am saying when I mention the term
> "wannabees." I think we are being pretty strongly propagandized right
> now,
> with the alerts, predictions of cost in fighting terrorism, etc. and
> those
> who are emotionally tied to military history are very quick to jump on
> the
> war band wagon. I am tied to it in the same way. But there are lots of
> level heads out there, with much military experience, who are saying to
> be
> cautious with this one; they realize that maybe this is not as serious
> as
> we make it out to be. I am very concerned that we are being driven down
> a
> road that has fewer forks in the future.
> We shouldn't be led there by wannabee power projectionists. If our
> administration thinks that we can send Madison Avenue to Europe, Africa,
> the
> Middle East, and Asia and improve the US image while we are engaging in
> hostile acts against Iraq, they are wrong. The world judges us not by
> the
> last two years of our history, but the last 40 years. Vietnam, refusal
> to
> ship wheat to Russia during famines, indifference during African
> revolution
> and genocide, refusal to deal with the Indian Subcontinent crisis (which
> is
> a MUCH more serious threat to world stability than Iraq, as far as I am
> concerned-remember what nationality sells you your morning coffee every
> day
> and what they could put in it), and corporate ventures into China's
> economy
> without end. We don't look good. There are countries out there that
> look
> at us as Germany was perceived during WWII, with great horror, but no
> real
> way to stop us. We are pretty much the strongest military nation on
> earth,
> and we need to wield that power carefully-that's for sure...
>
> We might be able to keep a billion muslims from uniting, or postpone it
> for
> a while. But we might have trouble keeping a billion Hindu's, 2 billion
> Chinese, and a billion muslims from fighting us to a draw if we don't
> project our power wisely...
>
> Just a different point of view to think about...
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steve & Jeanne Keith" <cckw@attbi.com>
> To: "John Seidts" <jseidts@astory.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:06 AM
> Subject: Re: [MV] The French
>
>
>>
>>
>> > I should've mentioned that.
>>
>> Prolly yes
>>
>> > Of course, that rant by me, former US Army
>> > Special Forces for 10 years....
>>
>> Thank you for your service to this country!
>>
>> With all due respect though, battlefield/military
>> experience is 'wonderful' teacher, however history
>> is a better one IMHO
>>
>> Thanks again
>> Steve
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
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-- Dave===Mil-Veh is a member-supported mailing list=== To unsubscribe, send e-mail to: <mil-veh-off@mil-veh.org> To switch to the DIGEST mode, send e-mail to <mil-veh-digest@mil-veh.org> To reach a human, contact <ack@mil-veh.org>
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