From: Adams-Graf, John (John.Adams-Graf@fwpubs.com)
Date: Tue Apr 26 2005 - 06:52:04 PDT
Terry:
Here is the link to a good article on paint color evolution that had appeared in Military Vehicles Magazine some time ago about paint color evolution:
http://www.collect.com/interest/article.asp?Pub=MV&id=4600
Also, there is an excellent synopsis of the evolution in the Standard Catalog of Military Vehicles, SECOND EDITION by David Doyle (pages 480-502).
Incidentally, the specification for that created the number "A/N 319" was introduced in January 1943 ("A/N" meaning "Army/Navy"). It was not adopted by the Army Air Corps because it did not inhibit infrared detection. It was the same color as Olive Drab number 22--just a new designation.
Olive Drab no. 22 was a designation created by the Quartermaster Corps in October 1940. The paint was to be made according to ES-474 ("Engineering Specification"). ES-474 was later replaced by ES-680.
In October 1942, responsibility for paint shifted BACK to the Corps of Engineers. They referred to their own specifications, Spec 3-1. Though the color was the same as Olive Drab no. 22, the Corps of Engineers had its own name: "No. 9 Olive Drab." The spec was updated to Corps of Engineers standards and adopted as "Specification 3-1F/Color Car Supplement (Revision 1)." This was issued on April 21, 1943
Before I go on...a bit of review:
Outbreak of World War II: All vehicles painted in Olive Drab No. 22
Olive Drab No. 22 is the same as No. 9 Olive Drab. A/N 319 Olive Drab is the same color as Olive Drab 22.
End of World War II: All vehicles painted in Olive Drab No. 22 (the same as No. 9 or A/N 319. One color, three names.)
SO....up until August 1, 1945, when Army Regulation 850-15 introduced a semigloss Olive Drab (for the very first time), all vehicles were painted in the same color (though the NAME of the color changed three times in four years).
Bear in mind, too, that AR 850-15 stated CLEARLY that vehicles were only to be repainted in semigloss when repainting was otherwise required. the September 1945 issue of Army Motors noted that the semigloss would not be available for 60-90 days. SO, during WWII, NO semigloss was approved for use on vehicles.
The rest of the story...In 1950, No. 22 Olive Drab was renamed "Olive Drab no. 3412". The semigloss specified in AR 850-15 was named "Olive Drab no. 2430". OD 2430 was the standard color of U.S. vehicles until 1956.
Hope this helps
John A-G
Iola, Wisconsin USA
-----Original Message-----
From: Military Vehicles Mailing List [mailto:mil-veh@mil-veh.org]On
Behalf Of Terry & Carolyn Welshans
Sent: Monday, April 25, 2005 8:42 PM
To: Military Vehicles Mailing List
Subject: Re: [MV] color of WW2 gensets
Steve said:
I have 2 WW2 gensets: 10kw PE95 and 3kw 3 phase M5
The PE95 is painted faded WW2 OD and the M5 appears
to be painted 50's 24087.
Were all the gensets in WW2 painted 34087 ( WW2 OD )?
Thanks
Steve AKA Dr Deuce
--------------------------
Steve, I am an FNG here, but I have done a little research on olive drab
paint for our weasels.
Here is an article that you may or may not know about:
[Quote]
Author Pete Harlem, Cutler Ridge, FL, USA.
The U.S. Army used a crude numbering system for its paints that dates back
to the late WW2. They have called Olive-Drab shade #9 through the 40's, 50's
and 60's even though the actual paint entered the FS (Federal Stock) number
system in the 50's. There is considerable confusion on the WW2 shade because
the airplane modeler and real aircraft restorers have suckered for a
different shade which was introduced in WW2 but never produced in quantity
before war ended. They maintain that the shade was used but reliable sources
say it never got to the troops or the aircraft. Testor's OD (34087) is
closer to the WW2 shade but should only be used for U.S. Army helicopters in
Vietnam. Only those used 34087 in the 60's, the vehicles being universally
darker. [/Quote]
That is the first paragraph on a whole page located at
http://www.mil-mod.nl/featod.html.
In summary:
The FS595b color scheme was invented in 1956, following a scheme called
TT-C-595 which was from 1950. So 34087 was not used until some time the
1960's. Today, the FS595b books do not have 14087, 24087, 34087 shade chips
as they were discontinued. The nearest matches now are FS595b shades 14084,
24084 and 34084.
The color stated in that article "Olive Drab #9" is no longer available from
any source except 60 year old NOS paint that you might find in a 5 gallon
pail. I found one in 1974 and the paint was as thick as tar, but worked OK
after thinning to 50%. The paint was officially named "Lusterless Olive
Drab shade #9" in some of the old purchasing contracts that I have seen.
By the way, the first digit after the FS is the amount of sheen that the
paint has. A "1" is glossy, a "2" is semi-gloss and a "3" is flat. Many
folks have written that "Lusterless" means "semi-gloss", not flat, so the
"2" series paints my be more accurate. I personally prefer the flat look.
I have found that the two most often quoted paint numbers for WWII OD are
"319" and "FS34087". Another color that many folks feel more closely
matches "Lusterless OD" is FS33070. I like this color more than the FS33070
color as it is more brown, while the FS34087 is more green. That old can of
paint that I had was more brown than green.
It is said that "319" was never used until after the war, although it was
approved in 1944.
If you want to see color swatches for the FS colors, this link:
http://www.ipmsstockholm.org/colorserver/ can do that for you. All you need
to do is type in the FS number (up to four at a time to see them together)
on your monitor. You won't get 34087, 319 or #9, however.
Regards,
Terry Welshans
Homer Glen, Illinois
"Always do right- this will gratify some and astonish the rest. "
Mark Twain (1835-1910)
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