From: timothy.smith1@att.net
Date: Mon Dec 19 2005 - 07:37:59 PST
> I have a couple of questions...
>
> Why do you differentiate between 10K+ trucks for interstate and
> intrastate?
Regulations specify this. It rolls in a lot of smaller vehicles that make short hops over or across state lines and other essentially interstate hauls. Remember, the trucking industry has a LOT to do with how these regulations are written. While regulation of the industry is indeed an issue of safety, make no mistake that the trucking industry is also motivated to ensure that every Tom, Dick & Harry with a truck doesn't begin hauling and cut into the market share. As a whole, the legislature doesn't know squat about the trucking industry (or any other industry for that matter) so they listen to the industry lobby in order to write these laws. As my Dad used to say, "We have the finest government money can buy."
Also, it is always important to keep in mind that there are often rules and regulations in effect beyond those in the book you may have in front of you at the moment, like the Code of Federal Regulations Title 49 ("CFR49", or just "Title 49"), administrative codes, uniform transportation codes. etc. FMCSR's applicability deals almost exclusively with vehicles in interstate commerce. Why? Because what goes on strict;y within the confines of a state is pretty much exclusively the state's own business.
Before we go any further, though, let's discuss just what "interstate commerce" is because later this may be of importance in our conversation. We'll start with a hypothetical haul-
A Roadway truck hauls a pallet of halftrack tracks from Gary Hebding's place in Illinois to the Roadway terminal in Amarillo, Texas. There should be no question in your mind that this is an Interstate haul as it crosses state boundry lines. However, in order to get the pallet to my house in Boerne, Texas, Gary Hebding has ALSO arranged for a hot-shot hauler operating a Mitsubishi FUSO with a GVWR of 14,500# to haul the pallet the remaining distance, which is entirely within the boundries of Texas (Amarillo to Boerne). The hot-shot truck IS in interstate commerce and here is why-
"GUIDANCE: Interstate commerce is determined by the essential character of the movement, manifested by the shipper's (in this case, Gary Hebding's) fixed and persistant intent at the time of shipment (to ship the pallet of tracks from Illinois to Boerne. Texas), and is ascertained from all of the facts and circumstances surrounding the transportation. When the intent of the transportation being performed is interstate IN NATURE (my italics), even when the route IS WITHIN THE BOUNDRIES OF A SINGLE STATE (my italics), the driver and the commercial motor vehicle are subject to the FMCSR's."
I hope you are sitting down for the next part. Remember that state law can supercede federal law if they are more stringent? Well, in Texas, they are. We now know that applicability of the FMCSR's for InTERstate haulers is based upon GVWR/GCVWR meeting or exceeding 10,001#.
***REMEMBER WE ARE NOT TALKING ABOUT CDL, NOW. WE ARE ONLY DISCUSSING WHO FALLS UNDER THE FMCSR's!***
Get ready for the bomb, cause here it comes....We determine applicability of FMCSR's for INTRAstate haulers by basing it upon GVWR/GCVWR, actual gross weight, registered gross weight, OR ANY COMBINATION THOSE that meets or exceeds 26,001# (Texas Transportation Code 644.001 & Texas Administrative Code 4.11).
Why are they different? I believe Texas (and any other state for that matter) wants to protect its own economy, so they favor the many little-truck guys and the small businesses by allowing them to haul stuff without the financial issues that come from all these regulations. But Texas also protects its own economy from outsiders in another way and that is to tell the small truck/small business INTERstate haulers that they have to comply with FMCSR's at a lower threshold weight (10,001#). But Texas wanted a balance, so they also gave us more ways to roll INTRAstate haulers into the FMCSR's by giving us more ways to reach the 26,001 pounds.
Right about now, you should be asking yourself, WHY is Texas allowed to mess with the FMCSR's? The answer is that technically they are not. What Texas did was adopt the FMCSR's as Texas law, so the more stringent add-ons we have been discussing are strictly a Texas thing unless it is referenced in CFR 49, or other federal regulation. In short, its pretty effing complicated and it leads to a lot of confusion, especially on the internet.
> As a DOT inspector, do you pursue IFTA and IRP issues also,
NO.
or are you
> strictly looking for DOT violations? IE, defective rigs, overweights,
> etc?
YES
I see the IFTA and IRP stuff a pretty much a tax issue.
Correct.
> Also, you seem to make a distinction between commercial vehicles and
> vehicles used in commerce. Are you talking about private carriers
> versus commercial carriers (carriers for hire with operating authority
> verus commercial guys that haul their own stuff - like me)
For purposes of determining CDL there IS a distinction. The easiest way of getting it clear in your mind is this...The PURPOSE for testing in order to acquire a driver's license is to ensure that the driver is qualified to operate the vehicle. They don't REALLY care what you are doing when you operate it.. So what you actually DO in a commercial TYPE of vehicle only matters when you are looking for an exemption, (such as farm, true RV's, certain emergency vehicles or governmental vehicles, active military vehicles, certain other agricultural specialty vehicles and certain others to vague to mention here). What does an exemption actually get you? One thing, and that is being excused from having to take an actual driving on the road test. Most of these exempted drivers (excluding active military) STILL have to take the written test for Class of license; A, B or C.
By some folks way of thinking, if a guy has an 18-wheeler that he uses exclusively for hauling his own stuff (and let's just say he's hauling a tank) he doesn't need a CDL. By this way of thinking, (which is wrong) we'd have a bunch of guys driving around in 80,000# vehicles with no assurances whatsoever, that the driver had a clue what he was doing because he was never actually examined! Anyone can pass a written test, but the real world is a much different place than a sheet of paper or a omputer screen.
> Other than the insurance requirements and the need for an
> authorization.. do you make any other distinctions when you do your job???
We pretty much stick to anything in the FMCSR's, authority (which is a very hot topic at the moment), and anything else that we might come across in the course of an inspection like smuggling of drugs or money (I found 1.7 million dollars in drug money last month!), human transportation, any type of larceny...you name it. It can get real interesting real fast!
TJ
> Remeber, this is coming from Texas..
> >
> > Weigh stations are a must when you're that big. Since you're "in disguise",
> they'll probably think you're the real military, wave & send you on through but
> weight laws apply to non
> > commercial vehicles as well as commercial. Better to get the "Hey stupid!
> Why are you in my scale lineup?" look from the scale operator than the "How DARE
> you pass my scales?!" look from the trooper.
> >
> > Folks have a tendency to think of weigh stations as a kind of forward base of
> operations for DOT guys. True, they hang out there a lot (if you want an apple,
> go to the tree, right?) but the real function of the weigh station is to check
> for overloads. Besides, weigh stations have bathrooms, phones, coffee, and a
> safe place to crawl under a truck without getting yer toes mashed.
> >
> > I'd like to clear something up for you that I fear you might have developed a
> misconception on..
> >
> > Think of CDL as a section of law unto itself. Your state my have adopted
> FMCSR's part 383, or they may have kept their own state drivers license law, but
> in any event, CDL law has threshhold weights and descriptions similar to, but
> different from, those weights and descriptions we use as guidance when
> determining who we can inspect for compliance with the FMCSR's.
> >
> > Our two topics stated simply:
> >
> > Who can a DOT inspector inspect? Vehicles in intERstate COMMERCE with a GVWR
> 10,001# or more and vehicles in intRAstate COMMERCE with a GVWR 26,001# or more.
> Key to this is "in commerce", rather than "commercial."
> >
> > Who needs a CDL? Drivers hauling certain amounts of hazmat, regardless of
> their vehicle's GVWR, but generally speaking, drivers operating vehicles with a
> GVWR or GCVWR OF 26,001# or more. This includes (by Texas law) ANY vehicle,
> whether in commerce or not.
> >
> > Texas has certain exemptions from CDL- for example, true RV's, emergency stuff
> like firetrucks, certain farm industry vehicles- but these exempted drivers
> still must have the correct type; A, B or C. For them, there is only a written
> test involved to get the correct type and its a no-brainer.
> >
> > Guys who need that CDL have to also take a driving test and demonstrate a
> certain level of proficiency (pre-trip inspection, etc). For many of us with
> large MV's, we find that the testing stations don't want to allow us to test in
> former MV's, which really sucks. And it seems the MVers can't seem to find a
> civvy truck to take the driving test in. I think THAT is the crux of the
> problem for most guys, who would otherwise just get their CDL and be done with
> it.
> >
> > ***************************
> > ANYWAY, take note, the two topics have similar threshold weights. Most
> important thing to help you on your way to understanding this stuff is
> remembering, we are talking about two entirely different topics that should be
> discussed independantly and not lumped together. So, before asking a question
> you'll need to decide exactly what topic you are asking about.
> >
> > So, if you're really sharp, after what I've told you, you might be able to
> imagine circumstance where I might be doing a DOT inspection on a truck that
> doesn't even require a CDL to drive! (Vehicle driven in interstate commerce,
> over 10k, but 26k or less.)
> >
> >
> >
> > TJ
> >
> >
> >
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> >
> >
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