From: Bruce C. Beattie (bruce@eecs.berkeley.edu)
Date: Wed May 10 2006 - 13:50:21 PDT
Well I guess I was all wet about this one. I would have thought that the
gear reduction starters drew LESS current.
I'm really glad you posted this Chris. I am definetely going to replace
that relay this weekend.
One thing about those new gear reduction starters, and that is that they
seem to work a lot better.
Very quick starting.
Thanks,
Bruce
Chris Brunner wrote:
> Guys, these are all great ideas, but the problem is much more simple.
> The new series starters (the gear reduction starters) draw much more
> power to close the contacts. The new starts draw something like 20amps
> instant, and 12amps constant to keep the starter engaged. That kind of
> power draw is just too much for the little relay that's under the
> dash. The older starters would draw about 12amp instant and 6amp
> constant to run - so they would work ok - only sometimes frying the
> relays.
>
> Although these other ideas are possible, what I'm writing about is a
> published problem. Start with a bigger relay first - and if that
> doesn't solve the problem then go to the mechanics. But just like the
> Fuel Pressure switch - this problem was everything short of published
> in the manual.
>
> Chris
>
> Glen Closson wrote:
>
>> Good point!
>> Or perhaps the teeth on the starter are engaging too far and past the
>> flywheel teeth and the shims move the starter away so that this
>> doesn't happen. Or am I on crack with this idea?
>>
>> Glen
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Bruce Kalin
>> Sent: May 10, 2006 1:26 PM
>> To: Glen Closson
>> Cc: Military Vehicles Mailing List
>> Subject: Re: [MV] Starter Saga V & ??
>>
>> Possibly a bent flywheel? That would keep it from engaging
>> sometimes, and from disengaging at other times.
>> Bruce
>>
>> Glen Closson wrote:
>>
>>> I'm thinking that there is something mechanically preventing the
>>> starter from disengaging. Like it getting “stuck” while engaged to
>>> the flywheel. That would explain why it works fine on the bench.
>>> What was the purpose of the shims that were mentioned earlier?
>>>
>>> Another option is to have an exorcism performed on your truck!
>>>
>>>
>>> Glen
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>
>>>
>>>> From: Ed <mojoedd@bellsouth.net>
>>>> Sent: May 9, 2006 8:54 PM
>>>> To: Military Vehicles Mailing List <mil-veh@mil-veh.org>
>>>> Subject: [MV] Starter Saga V & ??
>>>>
>>>> Well today saw us getting the starter checked on the bench
>>>> after getting it
>>>> back from the shop. Bench checked just fine, not a problem in
>>>> sight.
>>>> (Wait, it gets better)! Installed the starter on the truck,
>>>> secured all
>>>> battery cables, started truck, started just fine, not a problem
>>>> in sight.
>>>> (Wait, it gets better)! Found a couple of loose hose clamps on
>>>> the radiator
>>>> and tightened them up, leaks stopped, refilled coolant, not a
>>>> problem in
>>>> sight. (Wait, it gets better)! Started truck twice more,
>>>> "just for grins"
>>>> and to check for leaks, charging system, things that go bump in
>>>> the night,
>>>> not a problem in sight. (Wait, it gets better)! Drove the
>>>> truck to the
>>>> local Dairy Queen for a large Banana Cream Blizzard because we
>>>> finally
>>>> licked the dirty dog, planning to go by and pick up a heavy
>>>> duty relay for
>>>> installation of it and an in line fuse, "just in case", not a
>>>> problem in
>>>> sight. OK, here it comes.............Tried to start the truck
>>>> and it went
>>>> ballistic at the starter again!!!! This time I was ready and
>>>> pulled the
>>>> starter relay BEFORE it burned anything. Tore up my bad back
>>>> but saved the
>>>> truck!!
>>>>
>>>> Had to endure the jabs and jokes from my friend with the garage
>>>> that came in
>>>> his roll back to get me but at least nothing burned!
>>>>
>>>> OK, here's the deal, a couple of weeks ago I bought a brand
>>>> new, never
>>>> installed, still in the sealed box military starter from a guy
>>>> on Ebay that
>>>> I have dealt with many times with the very best of luck. This
>>>> starter is a
>>>> LOT smaller than the one that we took off the truck but I was
>>>> assured that
>>>> this was the proper starter for the M-1009 & M-1008. The
>>>> starter was a 24
>>>> VDC starter and it sounded great when starting the truck for
>>>> the two weeks
>>>> before the first burn up or out, what ever. This is when the
>>>> trouble
>>>> started. Nothing else has been added to or subtracted from the
>>>> truck before
>>>> or since. I have over 31 years experience working as an A&P
>>>> Mechanic on
>>>> everything from a Cessna 150 to a Boeing 747, I know how to
>>>> work on things
>>>> and I know how to check a circuit and wiring. A fellow A&P
>>>> Mechanic that I
>>>> had worked with for many years helped me check the wiring after
>>>> I made the
>>>> repairs. All checked good. All power was as spec'd in the
>>>> manual for the
>>>> M-1009 and it's wiring diagrams.
>>>>
>>>> Could it possibly be that this new starter needs a "beefed up"
>>>> starter relay
>>>> due to it's size or something else in it's system that we
>>>> aren't aware of?
>>>> Remember, the starter is the ONLY THING THAT HAS BEEN ADDED TO
>>>> IN THIS TIME
>>>> PERIOD OR ANYWHERE NEAR IT!
>>>>
>>>> I have caved in and taken it to a shop to pay for repairs. I
>>>> am going back
>>>> in with a normal starter under the dash, taking the wire
>>>> running from that
>>>> relay to the starter off of the starter and running it to a
>>>> brand new
>>>> Kenworth 24 VDC starter relay. Running the other leg of that
>>>> massive relay
>>>> through a larger wire and in line fuse to the starter. I'm
>>>> then going to
>>>> stand back and see what happens. I told the shop to check out
>>>> everything,
>>>> do the mod as I described it, (thanks to Chris Brunner for the
>>>> idea), start
>>>> the truck several times, drive it for a few hours, run errands,
>>>> what ever
>>>> and if it doesn't fail call me. If it fails I told them to run
>>>> it off a
>>>> cliff!! Damn, we don't have cliffs around here!
>>>>
>>>> Does anyone have any other idea WHY this damn thing failed
>>>> again other than
>>>> what I said above? Can it be anything other than the new
>>>> starter? This
>>>> starter had the solenoid replaced and then rechecked again by a
>>>> VERY good
>>>> electrical shop and was found to be working 100% correctly!?!?
>>>> Any thoughts
>>>> would be greatly appreciated!
>>>>
>>>> Again thanks to all who have responded and helped, Bless you
>>>> all, I can't
>>>> say enough about you guys, you are the best!
>>>>
>>>> Best Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Ed
>>>>
>>>> "The consolidation of the States into one vast empire, sure to be
>>>> aggressive abroad and despotic at home, will be the certain
>>>> precursor of ruin which has overwhelmed all that preceded it."
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Glen
>>>
>>> =Mil-Veh is a member-supported mailing list===
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>>> To reach a human, contact <ackyle@gmail.com>
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> -- Bruce Kalin
>> East Coast Convoy Coordinator
>> USMCMTA, MVPA, MTANJ, NCMVPA
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Glen
>> =Mil-Veh is a member-supported mailing list=== To unsubscribe, send
>> e-mail to To reach a human, contact Visit the searchable archives at
>> http://www.mil-veh.org/archives/
>
>
> ===Mil-Veh is a member-supported mailing list===
> To unsubscribe, send e-mail to <mil-veh-off@mil-veh.org>
> To reach a human, contact <ackyle@gmail.com>
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